Ford Focus ST Forum banner
1041 - 1060 of 1099 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,069 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,041 · (Edited)
If you were closer, I'd have pushed you out the way and given it "Ye Olde Dueceover" and sorted that ****er, but nooooooooooooo, you like lobsters and snow for some reason.
lol I appreciate the offer, I'm sure you'd have it sorted in no time at all.

A damn shame really I don't even like lobster, but I do like fall foliage and mountain roads.

Humor aside.

I'd go traditional troubleshooting. Like always. Assume nothing, check everything. Start with the basics and work your way through.

Spark plugs, boost leak test, verify map sensors, ign corrections, exhaust leaks, check O2's, check grounds, false knock? , etc

PCV system, intake leaks, is your catch can open!!! the basics.
Thanks for the suggestions, I guess this is how I need to approach this if I want to get this solved, double check everything, and don't spend too much time over analyzing test results. The reality is that since this is the first car I've been this deeply involved in, I'm still learning what to check and when :geek: Especially if its a problem that not many people have had on this platform.
Ah, the life of an engineer... Always looking for logic in an erratic or unusual situation, haha. I know the feeling, but I also have a Wife. Logic doesn't work well with women, so I guess that's where I find balance in life. "Where is the thing I put exactly right there 32 minutes ago??", "Oh, I put it away... somewhere (sweeping and circling arm motion) over there." Faaaa-Q! haha.

Anyways, have you done a leak down test? I know you already ran the compression test.
Lol can you tell I'm not that experienced...no wife yet ;)

I didn't do a leakdown test, I almost bought the tester but kidna shied away from it, I don't think I need that, if my catch can was filling up really rapidly I would run a leakdown test, but the car runs fine, it just struggles to start. Leakdown test is on the backburner for now.

You're the 3rd or 4th person that's had low numbers with the harbor freight tool.

When you're cranking the engine. The cam phasers are parked with a lock pin. Timing changes arent possible until oil pressure is built.
Thank you for the reply this is really helpful! This means I can probably just ignore the low numbers on the tester, and I can move my search away from the cam phasers, I really appreciate this!



In general here is a list of everything I have looked at so far:
  • There are no stored or pending codes
  • Battery tested good at atuozone
  • Starter tested good at autozone (not sure about how this test works)
  • Compression is good
  • HPFP always meets commanded pressure
  • LPFP holds ~100PSI for at least 5 minutes
  • Coolant does not leak into cylinders
  • Coolant system holds pressure (15PSI)
  • Coolant is not being lost
  • Combustion gas does not leak into coolant system
  • Crankcase pressure is within prescribed limits per shop manual
  • Oil is not mixed with coolant
  • Oil is not mixed with gasoline
  • Oil is not being lost
  • Spark plugs are new (no misfires once started assume ignition system is ok?)
  • PCV hoses and CCV hoses are not cracked and are properly connected
  • O2 sensors are properly connected and have no melted or broken cables
  • Changing tune does not change the symptom

So where does that leave me? If Compression is there, and spark is there, and timing is there, then that just brings me right back to the fuel system.

Here is a list of things I need to check:
  • MAP sensors
  • Temp sensors
  • lines in and around the turbo
  • Injectors themselves (O-rings and teflon)
  • Injector wiring (right order, frayed or broken wires etc)
  • High pressure fuel line
  • Wiring (to and around the injectors)
  • Coolant temp sensor
  • Cylinder head temp sensor
  • AC dependency
  • leakdown test
  • BOV vacuum line
  • smoke test
  • boost leak test

If you guys think of anything else that I should check or you would check then let me know and I'll add it to the list! I think if I can get the right PID monitored I should be able to catch this issue on a forscan data log, the trick is just knowing where to look. Forscan is super powerful I'm realizing, being able to watch the data live during cranking is amazing.

The other symptom I've noticed is that on a cold morning it starts fine, and in general if the temperature is low the car starts well, if its warm out (above 60F) and you let is sit for a half hour, it starts like absolute ass.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
509 Posts
Still sounds fuel related like it doesn’t have enough fuel rail pressure when warm and kinda vapor locks? I know you said all the pressures check out good. Is the new turbo letting too much heat up towards any fuel lines?

I might have missed this, but is the A/C on or off?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,069 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,043 ·
Still sounds fuel related like it doesn’t have enough fuel rail pressure when warm and kinda vapor locks? I know you said all the pressures check out good. Is the new turbo letting too much heat up towards any fuel lines?

I might have missed this, but is the A/C on or off?
I also think it sounds fuel related, Doubtful of a vapor lock issue, as that would have appears as soon as the tune was completed or when the turbo went in, this issue began three weeks after the tune was fully completed. Plus the HPFP line runs right along the side of the block, if it was going to boil it would have boiled.

Haven't checked if the AC makes a difference, what is your thinking?
 

·
Super Moderator
2014 ST3. Garrett Powermax turbo, Thermal Turboback, CPE intercooler, JBR intake, Innovative RMM
Joined
·
4,960 Posts
Something to check just-because, would be that the injectors are plugged in the correct order (verify by wire color)

Hear me out. I would think it would in general run like dogshit if two were swapped, but weirder things have happened, depending how close 2 cylinders are in firing order, or if the injector is spraying on the end of exhaust/beginning of intake stroke, you could be puddling fuel and not igniting an atomized mixture. I just want to 100%verify the signal wire to the injector is at the correct cylinder, as we are running out of possibilities.
 
  • Like
Reactions: junits15

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,069 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,046 ·
Something to check just-because, would be that the injectors are plugged in the correct order (verify by wire color)

Hear me out. I would think it would in general run like dogshit if two were swapped, but weirder things have happened, depending how close 2 cylinders are in firing order, or if the injector is spraying on the end of exhaust/beginning of intake stroke, you could be puddling fuel and not igniting an atomized mixture. I just want to 100%verify the signal wire to the injector is at the correct cylinder, as we are running out of possibilities.
another thing on the list of things to check! Thank you!

Unfortunately I can't look at it until next Saturday :/ I'm moving this weekend, then all of next week I have a midterm to complete.

Silly me thinking that by going to a mechanic I would avoid having to **** around with the car, in reality its just made it 10x worse becasue I dont know what he actually did.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
13,012 Posts
another thing on the list of things to check! Thank you!

Unfortunately I can't look at it until next Saturday :/ I'm moving this weekend, then all of next week I have a midterm to complete.

Silly me thinking that by going to a mechanic I would avoid having to **** around with the car, in reality its just made it 10x worse becasue I dont know what he actually did.
Yep.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,574 Posts
There was a reason the business name changed to Monster, I had talked to serval people now who said he used to blow engines and was learning on customer cars…
I was just told this the other day by someone who blew their Fiesta with one of his tunes..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,574 Posts
Yikes

What’s the story?
A bud with a Fiesta ran his tune and blew his motor, he said this was a big problem and is discussed on the Fiesta forums. Reason Monster came up is I was telling him about a post in my throttle body thread about the member that had a nice gain with the bot on and mentioned the adapt x tune and thats when the discussion turned to past problems with Monster.
 
  • Wow
Reactions: junits15

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,069 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,052 ·
Have you checked all the vacuum lines? Maybe a small vacuum leak?
it feels so obvious, checking for vacuum leaks has been a standard diagnosis step since cars were invented, but I haven't, I think I will take a look at my BOV and associated lines. I guess I had got so used to this car with only one vacuum line that I had forgot to check it.

Its possible that by messing with them he ripped a line or something similar.

Thank you for the suggestion I'll add it to the list!
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
13,012 Posts
it feels so obvious, checking for vacuum leaks has been a standard diagnosis step since cars were invented, but I haven't, I think I will take a look at my BOV and associated lines. I guess I had got so used to this car with only one vacuum line that I had forgot to check it.

Its possible that by messing with them he ripped a line or something similar.

Thank you for the suggestion I'll add it to the list!
Yeah man. Basic troubleshooting. A boost leak test will test vac lines too.

Also, retrace all the parts/lines involved with removing the intake mani.
 
  • Like
Reactions: junits15

·
Registered
2016 Oxford White
Joined
·
531 Posts
it feels so obvious, checking for vacuum leaks has been a standard diagnosis step since cars were invented, but I haven't, I think I will take a look at my BOV and associated lines. I guess I had got so used to this car with only one vacuum line that I had forgot to check it.

Its possible that by messing with them he ripped a line or something similar.

Thank you for the suggestion I'll add it to the list!
It's a common problem with old motorcycles, and I've worked on a lot of them. Easy enough to check, and often times vacuum lines will start to crack fairly quickly especially when heat is involved.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,069 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,055 ·
It's a common problem with old motorcycles, and I've worked on a lot of them. Easy enough to check, and often times vacuum lines will start to crack fairly quickly especially when heat is involved.
I will absolutely be checking this as well as vacuum testing the bov itself. I had recently taken it apart to mess with the heavier spring but I didn't see any rips or tears. Its an easy test though and worth doing.

I have the line running next to the oil filter housing, which is admittedly not the best way to do that lol. Lots of abrasion and heat.
 

·
Registered
15 TB Focus ST3
Joined
·
656 Posts
I will absolutely be checking this as well as vacuum testing the bov itself. I had recently taken it apart to mess with the heavier spring but I didn't see any rips or tears. Its an easy test though and worth doing.

I have the line running next to the oil filter housing, which is admittedly not the best way to do that lol. Lots of abrasion and heat.
I recently completed an oil change and just happened to get under the car again while it was on and noticed my line to bov while under vacuum was collapsed on itself from pressure; the line had become soft over sometime from coming into contact with oil while doing changes. Just saying.
 
  • Like
Reactions: junits15

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,069 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,057 ·
Yeah man. Basic troubleshooting. A boost leak test will test vac lines too.

Also, retrace all the parts/lines involved with removing the intake mani.
I think the first thing I will do is run a smoke test, I have an old smoke tester that I jerry rigged up years ago while working on other cars. That should alert any obvious leaks in and around the whole intake system.

I recently completed an oil change and just happened to get under the car again while it was on and noticed my line to bov while under vacuum was collapsed on itself from pressure; the line had become soft over sometime from coming into contact with oil while doing changes. Just saying.
That line does get pretty oily when working on it, I think I will replace it with a silicone line just for peace of mind while I'm in there.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,069 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,058 ·
Bunch of parts on order I really hate firing up the parts cannon but sometimes its inevitable:
  • New high pressure fuel line - have
  • new HPFP - have
  • new manifold gaskets - in transit
  • boost leak tester - in transit
  • Silicone BOV vacuum line - have
This weekend I will be doing the following items:
  • Smoke test for vacuum leaks
  • Boost leak test (pending tester availability)
  • thorough visual inspection of entire intake manifold area
    • manifold - inspect for cracks
    • manifold seals - inspect
    • injector wiring - ensure all injectors properly connected to the right harness
      • also check loom on right hand side of manifold, potential pinch under boomba catch can bracket.
    • injector seals - o ring seals, teflon seals, plastic spacers
    • injector bores - inspect for carbon and debris
    • fuel rail - inspect high pressure inlet threads, and individual injector ports
    • evap port - inspect for small cracks etc.
  • Check MAP sensor
    • electrically test for shorts open etc
    • check for bent/bad pins
    • check sealing o-ring
    • tap sensor while checking to check for vibration/intermittent failures
  • Check coolant temp sensor
    • electrically test for shorts open etc
    • check for bent/bad pins
    • tap sensor while checking to check for vibration/intermittent failures
  • remove and replace high pressure fuel line.
  • remove and replace high pressure fuel pump
  • inspect tappet
  • remove inspect and replace BOV vacuum line
    • replace with silicone line and clamps
  • inspect vacuum lines in and around EBCS
  • inspect crankcase breather plate for blown seals, leaks, stuck check valve, etc.

wish me luck, if you see anything missing let me know, I'll be running down this list with a fine toothed comb.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
13,012 Posts
Bunch of parts on order I really hate firing up the parts cannon but sometimes its inevitable:
  • New high pressure fuel line - have
  • new HPFP - have
  • new manifold gaskets - in transit
  • boost leak tester - in transit
  • Silicone BOV vacuum line - have
This weekend I will be doing the following items:
  • Smoke test for vacuum leaks
  • Boost leak test (pending tester availability)
  • thorough visual inspection of entire intake manifold area
    • manifold - inspect for cracks
    • manifold seals - inspect
    • injector wiring - ensure all injectors properly connected to the right harness
      • also check loom on right hand side of manifold, potential pinch under boomba catch can bracket.
    • injector seals - o ring seals, teflon seals, plastic spacers
    • injector bores - inspect for carbon and debris
    • fuel rail - inspect high pressure inlet threads, and individual injector ports
    • evap port - inspect for small cracks etc.
  • Check MAP sensor
    • electrically test for shorts open etc
    • check for bent/bad pins
    • check sealing o-ring
    • tap sensor while checking to check for vibration/intermittent failures
  • Check coolant temp sensor
    • electrically test for shorts open etc
    • check for bent/bad pins
    • tap sensor while checking to check for vibration/intermittent failures
  • remove and replace high pressure fuel line.
  • remove and replace high pressure fuel pump
  • inspect tappet
  • remove inspect and replace BOV vacuum line
    • replace with silicone line and clamps
  • inspect vacuum lines in and around EBCS
  • inspect crankcase breather plate for blown seals, leaks, stuck check valve, etc.

wish me luck, if you see anything missing let me know, I'll be running down this list with a fine toothed comb.
Cool. It's going to be super frustrating when that doesnt fix anything...
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Habriant40

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,069 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,060 ·
Cool. It's going to be super frustrating when that doesnt fix anything...
dont worry I'm already mentally preparing for that lol.

I'm a lot more relaxed now that I know it isn't a gasket, before I didn't really diagnose the issue, I just tested the gasket three different ways lol.
 
1041 - 1060 of 1099 Posts
Top