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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Still a ways off from making this move, but I like planning ahead. I plan to buy an ATP turbo kit from Stratified within the next year or so.

The Question: GTX2867r or GTX2863r turbo for a daily driver w/ modest bolt-ons and aux fuel?

The Supporting Mods:
Depo 3.5" IC (already installed)
Depo catted downpipe (already installed)
Custom Magnaflow cat-cack using the stock piping (working on compiling parts)
Velossa Tech snorkel, K&N airbox lid and filter, Panda inlet pipe(already installed)
Stratified V2 Aux fuel (hoping to find a kit used within the next year)

The Goals:
I would like to make about 360 whp while maintaining excellent driveability and reliability.
I would like to hold peak boost very close to redline.
I'm currently running an e30 mix, but I could push that up to e50 w/ aux fuel. We don't have e85 here in AZ anymore, it's e54. So it would be super convenient to run straight e54 actually.


I know the 2867 is far more popular and highly recommended by Stratified... but the quicker spool of the 2863 is intriguing to me for a DD, along with the fact that the upside of the 2867 is way above my goals.

I also feel like my downpipe/ cat-back setup would limit the 2867 but would probably handle the flow rate of the 2863 just fine.

It seems like most people looking to go big turbo on their daily feel the same way... so I can't figure out why no one goes with the 2863.

Right now my plan is to go with the 2863... but would love to hear others' thoughts.

Thanks!
 

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I honestly think you'll prefer the tradeoff of being able to comfortably make ~360-380 (it would be more but I think your cat will limit you) with power the whole way to redline with the 2867. The 2863 will put you probably right at your goals without any room for any higher and you might not have the power to redline that you want. 2867's only spool like 300-500rpm slower than stock I'm pretty sure with the .64 housing so honestly I'd recommend that.

Now had you said your goal was 330-340 dd car I'd say the 2863 because I feel it's the best compromise. 2867 would work for that if you didn't have Aux fueling I suppose lol
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I honestly think you'll prefer the tradeoff of being able to comfortably make ~360-380 (it would be more but I think your cat will limit you) with power the whole way to redline with the 2867. The 2863 will put you probably right at your goals without any room for any higher and you might not have the power to redline that you want. 2867's only spool like 300-500rpm slower than stock I'm pretty sure with the .64 housing so honestly I'd recommend that.

Now had you said your goal was 330-340 dd car I'd say the 2863 because I feel it's the best compromise. 2867 would work for that if you didn't have Aux fueling I suppose lol
That's good information thanks.

And you touched on another point I was curious about... with a catted downpipe, does the cat-back make a difference even w/ a 2867? I think the answer would be would be no, the cat is the point of restriction (even though Depo's cat is 100 cell rather than 200 like other aftermarket dp's or 800 like stock) so anything after the cat is superfluous.

Just trying to convince myself that I won't need a 3" exhaust, and a custom cat-back based on the stock piping will be sufficient.
 

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That's good information thanks.

And you touched on another point I was curious about... with a catted downpipe, does the cat-back make a difference even w/ a 2867? I think the answer would be would be no, the cat is the point of restriction (even though Depo's cat is 100 cell rather than 200 like other aftermarket dp's or 800 like stock) so anything after the cat is superfluous.

Just trying to convince myself that I won't need a 3" exhaust, and a custom cat-back based on the stock piping will be sufficient.
I think on BT vehicles a bigger catback is a little more needed than stock. Stock it isn't needed at all but I think once you go BT you start having to consider upgrading it, this part I don't know enough in detail to provide input on. Someone else may have to comment there. I know when Stratified first tested one of their 2867 cars they couldn't hit 400hp on aux fueling and got stuck at 380-390 because with a cat they just couldn't get more power because it held them back. And it was a Cobb hi flow cat.
 
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I'm having a similar debate myself, but I would remain 93 only. In my case, I think the 63 or EFR6258 is the easy choice.

Since you have access to E85 and have aux fueling... I know you don't wanna push the limits, but I would probably opt for a 67mm variety to give myself a little headroom. Having a little larger turbo can also help 'overcome' some other restrictions such as running stock exhaust or catted downpipe etc.

At the end of the day it probably comes down to if your preference on maximizing low/mid range vs mid/high rpm torque. You can certainly hit those power goals on ethanol mixes and the 63mm turbo.
 

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Yeah I've searched GTX2863R extensively on here, lol. I am honestly surprised it's not a more popular option. I don't want 400+ hp in FWD or need it for a DD.

I'd recommend the 6258, but being 'stage 3' already, the GTX is the logical choice I suppose.
 

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Yeah I've searched GTX2863R extensively on here, lol. I am honestly surprised it's not a more popular option. I don't want 400+ hp in FWD or need it for a DD.

I'd recommend the 6258, but being 'stage 3' already, the GTX is the logical choice I suppose.
I guess I look at things a little differently because I don't make enough money :lol: if I'm buying a 2k+ dollar turbo and spending a grand in other labor and whatnot to install and get tuned for it then I want to make the most safely that I can for my money. If I'm spending 1-200 less for a smaller turbo it makes me feel like I wasted a little bit of money considering how expensive it is for bolt ons just to make an extra 50-60hp before you go BT...an extra 1-200 for 50hp seems worth it. DD or not I need the power :cool:
 

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The 63 is a better choice than the 67. The 67 is a horrible turbo and everyone outside this community knows it. The turbine is just too small for the compressor. I know @TuxedST and honestly if he did it again he said he'd do the .86 housing. The turbo spools very quick and flows well so traction becomes a issue. With the .86 housing it will make 425 all day long
 

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I had a turbo Miata before (1.8L, GTX2867R, custom intake manifold) and I learned that bigger is not always better. It made around 390whp at 20psi and was super efficient, but the low end sucked and I hated the overall feel and power delivery of it. Previously I had the stock intake manifold and GT2560R on it, and it was amazing (only 275whp).

It really comes down to right turbo for the right application / goals. OP mentions maintain excellent drivability and 360whp--I see no reason why an eth mix / aux fuel 2863 couldn't do that easily. Smallest turbo that can efficiently hit target power goal is usually the best. Problem is most people want more / goals change, that's the challenge and you just gotta be honest with yourself.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
The 63 is a better choice than the 67. The 67 is a horrible turbo and everyone outside this community knows it. The turbine is just too small for the compressor. I know @TuxedST and honestly if he did it again he said he'd do the .86 housing. The turbo spools very quick and flows well so traction becomes a issue. With the .86 housing it will make 425 all day long
Hm. That's an interesting thought. I've never heard of anyone saying that a turbo spools too quick... sounds like a good problem to me!

From what I've read Stratified's traction control is pretty killer. I'm not looking to push that much power so I think the gtx2863r w/ .64 housing would be perfect for me, my mods, and my goals.
 

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I had a turbo Miata before (1.8L, GTX2867R, custom intake manifold) and I learned that bigger is not always better. It made around 390whp at 20psi and was super efficient, but the low end sucked and I hated the overall feel and power delivery of it. Previously I had the stock intake manifold and GT2560R on it, and it was amazing (only 275whp).

It really comes down to right turbo for the right application / goals. OP mentions maintain excellent drivability and I see no reason why an eth mix / aux fuel 2863 couldn't do that easily. Smallest turbo that can efficiently hit target power goal is usually the best. Problem is most people want more / goals change, that's the challenge and you just gotta be honest with yourself.
Agreed its all about what you want the car to do. My ST was setup for canyon runs so I went with the GT2860RS. Car wasn't the fastest but it was fun to drive and ripped canyons up. Here's where it ended up power wise

Text Line Design Diagram Font
 

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Hm. That's an interesting thought. I've never heard of anyone saying that a turbo spools too quick... sounds like a good problem to me!

From what I've read Stratified's traction control is pretty killer. I'm not looking to push that much power so I think the gtx2863r w/ .64 housing would be perfect for me, my mods, and my goals.
I was actually thinking the same thing for my own DD...but I'd be careful using the stock exhaust piping from what I've read. I mean I have the 2.5' Borla, which is 0.25" bigger than stock. I think running the stock diameter, the cat shouldn't necessarily restrict you too much.

GTX for sure with all the bolt ons, and for me, I don't even plan on using Aux fuel, but I have access to E85, so I could easily do E30 if need be.

I've been having this same debate with myself for a while now, glad you posted this question up!
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I was actually thinking the same thing for my own DD...but I'd be careful using the stock exhaust piping from what I've read. I mean I have the 2.5' Borla, which is 0.25" bigger than stock. I think running the stock diameter, the cat shouldn't necessarily restrict you too much.

GTX for sure with all the bolt ons, and for me, I don't even plan on using Aux fuel, but I have access to E85, so I could easily do E30 if need be.

I've been having this same debate with myself for a while now, glad you posted this question up!
Are you saying that you think the stock exhaust piping would be more of a restriction than a 100cell cat?

I wouldn't think so. From what I've read, the restrictions in the stock exhaust are as follows: Downpipe > Muffler > small crush-bent piping

I feel like even a high-flow catted downpipe is more of a restriction than that small piping section that goes over the rear axle, but I could be wrong.
 

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I have just been through this process and am currently waiting on my turbo to arrive. I went with the GTX2867r 0.64 a/r. I spent a couple of months looking into this and my decision was between these two as well.

What tipped me over was the availability of E85 locally and the possibility of me using said fuel with an aux fuel kit in the future. Right now I have no plans to do so in the next year as I have a little one due soon so will spend money on more important things. However, I know how I am and this car was meant to stay stock, then stage 1, now it's got every bolt on + a big turbo, so the likelyhood of me calling Alex in a year (or less haha) regarding 4 port injection and new internals is about 100%.

I watched all the reviews on youtube and Keola36 mentioned in the comments that the GTX2863r felt like it started to drop power near redline. Also look at dyno's, the 2867r can be easier to hold power to redline and for me that was a priority. The K03 makes me want to cry the way it just falls flat on its face above 5.5k RPM.

One other bit of advice is allow some growing room from your goal, for me my goal 6 months ago was 330whp then I drove one here locally and as well as a 380whp. Fair to say your goals may change and the spool penalty of 100-200rpm for the bigger 2867 to me is well worth the 30whp or so additional horsepower I may be chasing in a year + the pull all the way to redline.

Best of luck,
Regardless of what you pick it will be a lot more fun than the stock K03 pimple of a turbo.
 

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Back in 2015 when i was researching for my turbo the 2867 and 2863 were the ones i was interested in.I think the 2863 fits your goals nicely and with aux fuel running e30-50 you can get to 400whp if you choose to want a little more than your current goal later on.I'm very happy with my choice of picking the 2863r as it spools very quick and holds power up top.Here is a vdyno from nov last year when alex and i were doing a top up tune for my breedt im which got cut short due to getting some real crappy shell 93 blended in with my e40 mix.A little more ethanol blend of say e45 and my 4 port aux fuel kit,along with 63mm tb will put the 2863 to 400+whp.
Text Line Plot Design Parallel
 

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I think on BT vehicles a bigger catback is a little more needed than stock. Stock it isn't needed at all but I think once you go BT you start having to consider upgrading it, this part I don't know enough in detail to provide input on. Someone else may have to comment there. I know when Stratified first tested one of their 2867 cars they couldn't hit 400hp on aux fueling and got stuck at 380-390 because with a cat they just couldn't get more power because it held them back. And it was a Cobb hi flow cat.
I made 402whp with my 2867 .86 and Cobb hi flow cat. So your goal of 360-380 with your downpipe is not an issue. If your goal is never to go over 380, then do the 2863 .86 and call it a day. That will keep you close to stock for spool, but the .86 A/R will help take you to redline!
Enjoy!
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Back in 2015 when i was researching for my turbo the 2867 and 2863 were the ones i was interested in.I think the 2863 fits your goals nicely and with aux fuel running e30-50 you can get to 400whp if you choose to want a little more than your current goal later on.I'm very happy with my choice of picking the 2863r as it spools very quick and holds power up top.Here is a vdyno from nov last year when alex and i were doing a top up tune for my breedt im which got cut short due to getting some real crappy shell 93 blended in with my e40 mix.A little more ethanol blend of say e45 and my 4 port aux fuel kit,along with 63mm tb will put the 2863 to 400+whp.
View attachment 235665
Damn that looks awesome. Is that w/ the .64 a/r or .86?
 

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