[RR13ST3]

Subaru - it's faster and has few limited slip differentials.. ST - none

 

[dgc333]

Also even though I haven't driven a new WRX. I don't think it handles better. AWD or not. The ST is a very well balanced awesome handling FWD car.

Motor trend just did a comparison between the ST and 15 WRX.

It beat the ST in every measureable performance area. They especially liked the handling, it was much more stable at the limit and even with the increased handling it road better. The WRX was about 2.5 seconds faster around the road course they were using for the test.

They even liked the WRX seats over the STs Recarros.

 

[w00t692]

Everyone in here just assumes things with no proof, don't bother.

 

[koopiskeva]

'Everyone' includes yourself. Don't cast out such a large net.

 

[MrTMB]

'Everyone' includes yourself. Don't cast out such a large net.

Btw, may I borrow some of your status?

 

[w00t692]

I assumed people would be intelligent enough to notice I mentioned "tune" and if they wanted to know what I was tuned for they simply had to look at the Vdyno I posted for the details of said tune, as you did. Those are the same numbers I was making before E30 just using regular 92 octane since that E30 map is a baseline map.

That COBB WRX map doesn't look bad but it's falling on its face past 6000 RPM harder than the ST does. If the map is still in development hopefully they fix that part since it doesn't seem to have that issue as bad when stock. However, the stock map on the WRX has no low-end grunt which is worse than having no top-end power. 90% of daily driving is in the low to midrange and not at high RPM.

Here's a Vdyno of a log I did while running 92 octane fuel with no ethanol added:
View attachment 54986

Notice how the numbers are almost identical to the E30 baseline map (only 5 less WHP and WTQ)? The E30 was not skewing results by much at all because it was a baseline map. However, once I get a few revisions done to the E30 map I should be closer to 280 WHP and 370 WTQ.

That is a completely bone stock wrx with a tune.

When were these vdyno's done? How's the weather? I can tell you now, my buddy's st is only making 255 whp and 340 tq on e30 mix with an FMIC and drop in filter.

 

[w00t692]

'Everyone' includes yourself. Don't cast out such a large net.

enough people to be noteworthy. How many times was it said the st handles better in here and turns out it doesn't?

 

[lug]

Everyone in here just assumes things with no proof, don't bother.

I assume you have data to back this up?

 

[w00t692]

The ST handles phenomenally well. The new wrx is more in line with the sti in handling terms nowadays, subaru listened to the complaints of the old one feeling very dull.

 

[Mikehuntisitchy]

I went to the Subaru dealer, all happy, excited and smiling thinking about my fall in love with the new bad ass WRX's and trade my ST not to mention they offered $1500.00 more on trade-in for my ST than any other dealer.

Long story short

Handling- WRX
Brakes- ST, which is weird because the WRX had better rated braking from 60mph-0mph, but dude...wow they were HORRIBLE I had to slam them and almost missed the dealer entrance on the way back...I kid you not.
Looks- ST, but the WRX is almost tied, both good looking cars, WRX need to eliminate some wheel gap and bump up to 18" wheels
Sound- ST, my ST is straight piped and I have listened to straight piped new WRX because of the equal length headers, I HATED it, no more deep Subaru ruble of fear.
Speed- ST, even though the WRX is rated to be quicker, the ST has WAY more feeling and pull to it, i was VERY shocked by this, I expected the WRX to feel/be gobs faster
Roominess- WRX, much much more comfortable
Interior- I love all the creature comforts of my ST but I prefer the lay out of the WRX honestly.
Drivetrain- WRX all day, FWD sucks booty hole.


At the end of the day, the sticker price of 27k on the base model WRX (not even fog lights) was way to much for me to trade in my Focus ST which I only paid 24.8k for brand in and I have the ST3 package with moonroof option.

I hate to say it, but I like my ST better...I didn't think the day would come I'd say I prefer domestic over import.

Keep in mind, I've had 2 subarus one being a 2006 Legacy GT Spec B and I have been obsessed with them ever since, so I was VERY disappointed when I didn't like the WRX. I HIGHLY prefer the sexy wide body 13-14 WRX but the ringland issue and those crappy EJ's can go to hell.








To each their own though, right? Goodluck, can't really go wrong with either of the cars!

 

[MrTMB]

That is a completely bone stock wrx with a tune.

When were these vdyno's done? How's the weather? I can tell you now, my buddy's st is only making 255 whp and 340 tq on e30 mix with an FMIC and drop in filter.

The weather was 70 degrees F three weeks ago when that Vdyno was taken (92 octane). Since I started the tuning process a month ago I've taken over 100 datalogs. I datalog always on the same stretch of road and always in both directions to verify the results (to negate wind or incline/decline). The weather was 5 degrees warmer (75 F) during the E30 log which was taken two days ago. My mods that might effect performance are: air intake pipe, air filter and FMIC.

What State are you both living in? Fuel quality varies greatly from region to region. The 92 octane we have here in WA State is decent quality so of course I will get decent results. However, if your friend is only getting 255 WHP and 340 WTQ with those mods and while using E30 then I would question the quality of the tune. It is common for people who are completely stock (as far as hardware goes) to make more power than that just running an E30 tune alone. On Alex's shop car when it was completely stock (the guy who is tuning my car) he made 259/327 using 92 octane and 274/371 using E30.

 

[luckypants]

What State are you both living in? Fuel quality varies greatly from region to region. The 92 octane we have here in WA State is decent quality so of course I will get decent results. However, if your friend is only getting 255 WHP and 340 WTQ with those mods and while using E30 then I would question the quality of the tune. It is common for people who are completely stock (as far as hardware goes) to make more power than that just running an E30 tune alone. On Alex's shop car when it was completely stock (the guy who is tuning my car) he made 259/327 using 92 octane and 274/371 using E30.

252hp/291tq on mine last October on my bro-in-law's jet with a Cobb intake and Milltek catback and stock tune. PA Sunoco 93

 

[MrTMB]

252hp/291tq on mine last October on my bro-in-law's jet with a Cobb intake and Milltek catback and stock tune. PA Sunoco 93

Ah, are you the friend that w00t692 keeps referencing?

Btw, the Vdyno for my car when it was completely stock and running the stock tune was showing 228/263 using 92 octane. Just for a reference for the gains after parts and a tune.

 

[luckypants]

Ah, are you the friend that w00t692 keeps referencing?

No, just a guy helping to make your point that his buddy making those numbers on ethanol with a cooler is the result of a bad tune and/or bad gas. With good fuel and consistent use these motors can make decent power stock.

 

[MrTMB]

No, just a guy helping to make your point that his buddy making those numbers on ethanol with a cooler is the result of a bad tune and/or bad gas. With good fuel and consistent use these motors can make decent power stock.

Alrighty. Thanks for the input . But something definitely sounds off with the tune if he is seeing such low numbers while running E30. The tune doesn't sound very optimized.

 

[Jypsu123]

Traded in my '13 ST2 for a '15 WRX Base so I'll see if I can help.

Handling: The WRX handles better then the ST. The ST handles amazingly but it's tendency to over steer gets old, quick. Obviously AWD vs FWD. Both have torque vectoring systems to help with turning.

Brakes: The ST has the better brakes, period.

Interior: I'm 6'2 260lbs and I loved the Recaros in the ST. I miss them dearly. The WRX is typical Subaru interior: pretty cheap and plastic feeling. Layout is nice and I personally like the faux carbon fiber trim pieces. The MFD is nice but I'd still prefer the ST's touchscreen/Sync.

Fuel Economy: Surprisingly, have to go with the WRX. My first tank netted me 33mpg, with me getting on it a few times. I don't know how other guys do it, but even babying my ST I was lucky to get 25mpg.

Power/Speed: I've "cruised" alongside a stock 2013 WRX and a stock 2014 ST1. If anything, the ST pulls harder. I noticed that when I traded in my '11 WRX for the '13 ST and it's even more apparent now in the '15 WRX. The WRX will obviously win from a dig, but rolling, it really came down to whoever jumped first. I should be able "cruise" with a stage 1 ST this weekend and I bet he pulls away. That's mostly the insane amount of torque the ST has. And the fact that the ST has a better Driver mod . However, I don't have to worry about tire hop/spin in the first 3 gears, so that's nice. The opposite side is that even tho the WRX has a twinscroll turbo, it still feels laggy compared to the ST.

Space: The WRX is more comfortable for back seat passengers. Everyone hated getting into my ST. Almost no one liked the Recarcos and there wasn't enough space in the backseat for anyone over 6 feet. The WRX is pretty much the opposite. People will say the hatch gives you more room, and while that's technically true, I was able to fit 4 tires and 4 boxes with rims into my '15. It's was tight, but it fit. Unless you travel a lot and need to take quite a few things with you, I wouldn't worry about trunk/interior space.

Verdict: Focus RS. Honestly, the WRX holds its value better in Colorado then the ST and was one of the reasons I ended up getting it. The AWD is also nice in the winter. I plan to pay it off in a few years and keep it as a daily driver and buy a Focus RS as my weekend car.

Excellent review/comparison.

https://www.facebook.com/estercost

 

[koopiskeva]

Btw, may I borrow some of your status?

Nope, all mine. o:

enough people to be noteworthy. How many times was it said the st handles better in here and turns out it doesn't?

There is definitely a bias around here, but I wouldn't cast out the net to be 'everyone.' There are many more members that don't hang around in this section of the forum.

I've personally not driven the new WRX, but if I didn't already have my ST, I'd probably have the new WRX now. Regardless, I couldn't say which handled 'better' - I've not tried the new WRX. In terms of raw numbers, according to stat sheets, the new WRX definitely should. But, there's a lot left on the table regarding driving feel/fun that can never really be accounted for unfortunately - and everyone has a different opinion on that. Even Randy Pobst, at least in his the STvsWRX head2head on MotorTrend, said that the ST was more fun, despite the WRX posting up better numbers.

 

[luckypants]

Alrighty. Thanks for the input . But something definitely sounds off with the tune if he is seeing such low numbers while running E30. The tune doesn't sound very optimized.

Agreed.

 

[w00t692]

The weather was 70 degrees F three weeks ago when that Vdyno was taken (92 octane). Since I started the tuning process a month ago I've taken over 100 datalogs. I datalog always on the same stretch of road and always in both directions to verify the results (to negate wind or incline/decline). The weather was 5 degrees warmer (75 F) during the E30 log which was taken two days ago. My mods that might effect performance are: air intake pipe, air filter and FMIC.

What State are you both living in? Fuel quality varies greatly from region to region. The 92 octane we have here in WA State is decent quality so of course I will get decent results. However, if your friend is only getting 255 WHP and 340 WTQ with those mods and while using E30 then I would question the quality of the tune. It is common for people who are completely stock (as far as hardware goes) to make more power than that just running an E30 tune alone. On Alex's shop car when it was completely stock (the guy who is tuning my car) he made 259/327 using 92 octane and 274/371 using E30.

We have exceptional 93 octane fuel here. and it's 90F here with 80-100% humidity every day. **** just from the weather we had 3 months ago my car dropped 20 horsepower and i can definitely feel it.

I mean his car made around 225/290'ish when stock.

If you want to make a suggestion on what he should look at in the tune go for it.

 

[Drew]

I have a really large penis and it wouldn't fit in the WRX, so that pretty much made up my mind for me...


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