I'm busy testing valve clearances on two heads and will see if its not that. I never had this problem on my low compression build, but since I've put in the OEM compression forged build mine has started doing this randomly.

 

7000 miles after my last check engine light and it's back on, 4th time for me. I was hoping that I was in the clear finally!

Less than 3000 miles left on my warranty, I might buy an extended warranty now.

 

You have a 2015 that's almost out of warranty?

Damn.

I'd advise against paying for the extended warranty

 

UPDATE

My dealership called me just now. You will not believe this.

So they had a field engineer look at my car. He was out there last Wednesday and he checked things out... collected some more data, etc.

My service writer Mark tells me that this engineer wants to swap the spark plug and injector on cylinder one with cylinder 4 to see if that changes anything.

If you've been following along- this is something that was done MONTHS AGO! Not only was the old "swap plugs and injectors around" done, but I've had all 4 injectors and plugs flat out replaced back in November of 2015!

This ****ing engineer has NO CLUE what to do. My dealership told him "uh, yeah... we did that a long time ago".

So...

They're going to try a new cylinder head. Greaaaaat. The best part is- the engineer says "well, the new head has solved this issue for some people". Incredible. It works for some people. What about everyone else? They have NO IDEA WHAT THEY'RE DOING.

But wait.

It gets better...

My guy at Fair Oaks Ford has to do a cost analysis of this head replacement. He flat out told me- after he runs the numbers, Ford may just end up telling him to replace the short block too


This is a nightmare.

I'm looking at at least 2 more weeks without my car... and they've already had it for 6 days on this latest run.

This car is awful.

 

Where's my man @tpiechow ?

 

Wow, I haven't followed up on this thread in a long time. Completely forgot about this one.

Fun fact, just rolled over 10,000 miles with no issues what-so-ever. I guess commuting 400 miles a week as hard as I can possible push the car has kept me immune to this misfire gremlin. I highly recommend trying that out!

And looks like the FSE (field service engineer) is not hip to the hop on the Ecoboost engines. You are not supposed to swap injectors as you automatically have to replace the seals. So replace the injector or leave it alone. So I don't agree with that. I also don't agree with swapping the plug since that has been done who knows how many times on how many vehicles. So the FSE must be trying to start at square one with diagnostics, he's probably never heard of this problem. Not helpful at this point.

And whoever told you that "after I run the number's, Ford just may tell them to replace the short block as well" is going on the list of morons along with the FSE. This "running the numbers" is just a cost cap tool. You determine what parts need to be replaced and the cost cap tool calculates how much it costs for the part, labor, miscellaneous parts,etc. Then compares that to the cost of replacing a long block, then gives a repair or replace decision.

So you should not be performing the cost cap tool if you are only replacing the head. So he is wrong there. Also, there is no calculator on the planet that is going to say is more effective to replace the short block over just the head. So he is wrong there. Also, in that case Ford wouldn't be telling him what to replace. If he had determined that the long block is more cost effective (which it's not), he would be applying for Prior Approval from Ford.

Which means that the dealer determined what that replacement of the long block is the most cost effective repair direction that they are looking for the Powertrain Prior Approval Team to make sure it's warrantable. Dealer decision, not Ford telling them what to replace. Moron. Also, when it comes to the cost cap tool, they should not be adding any components that have already been replaced.

So sounds like you got the short end of the stick and not only got a stupid dealer, but and FSE that has no idea what is going on. So you got two options. Let them replace the whatever they want or go for buy-back. Either way, your whining and crying isn't doing anyone any good and it sure as hell not getting your car fixed.

 

You confirmed exactly what I thought. Thank you.

I will say- I don't believe it's the dealer. My writer and the tech are right there with me (not just to appease me) and I'm highly inclined to believe them when they say Ford is driving the ship with this thing. Ford has been in charge since all 4 injectors were replaced. They're both frustrated with what the repair hotline and now this ridiculous engineer is telling them to do. We all agreed that this field engineer was a complete disaster (seriously... nobody could believe he recommended the "swap **** around" idea) and he's the one pushing for first the head and now possibly head+shortblock (longblock).

I may have mis-spoke (mis-quoted) when I mentioned the whole cost effective bit simply because I was so taken aback by what I was hearing at the time. I'll be hearing back from the dealer tomorrow and will ask more about the logic behind all this ****.

It's legitimately astounding how awful Ford is handling this. They're flat out telling me that they don't know the cause of this issue but they can say that a new cylinder head has 'fixed it' for 'some owners'. Like, you can't make this kind of stupidity up. It's unfathomable.

Buy-back isn't an option. I have an attorney.

 

Oh, and it's cute that your hard commuting (what?) is keeping your super sweet car trouble free.

10,000 miles is quite an achievement. Ford should make a commercial about that.

 

Yes I am quite surprised that I was able to put 10K on my ST in 5 months. But I was joking about the hard commuting. I mean I do run the ever living s*** out of my car every time I get in it and I do drive over 400 miles a week. But I don't think that has anything to do with the misfire you guys are experiencing.

Unless no one else has experienced misfires and has driven as many miles in such a short period of time? Carbon build up is much less likely the harder you drive your vehicle. If you baby an ST or only drive it short periods of time/part time, you are going to have issues with carbon.

Now I am with you about this being ridiculous, this should not be going on for this long. But I just want to point out that the Hotline and the FSE are only there to perform normal diagnostics that is published. They are not allowed to go above or beyond that. So I can see why the Hotline and FSE are frustrating but there is only so much they can do.

And that is with any case. If anyone is told by a dealer that they are contacting the Hotline or Engineering, it means that they don't know how to perform normal diagnostics. The hotline should not be contacted until all possible causes have been replaced based on normal diagnostics.

It's up to actual engineers who designed the car to document what has been done and what is going to need to be done to fix the vehicle. Even the FSE may have no idea that engineering is involved unless they specifically look. I would imagine most of the time they don't since it's not a common thing.

It is possible that even the smartest people at Ford are not going to be able to figure this out. It is possible that this is just the weirdest one off and the root cause will never be determined. Look at the 1.6L Escape engine.

The 1.6L engine was plagued with coolant intrusion issues. When I worked at the Hotline, the repair direction changed almost weekly because the engineers where doing everything in their power to determine the root cause and fix it once and for all.

After a year or two of trying, they were never able to fix it. Couldn't figure out what it was. So the solution ended up being to discontinue the 1.6L which is now replaced by the 1.5L. So not saying that is what is going to happen in this case, but just to show how some things are more difficult than they seem to figure out.

I've said before that I empathize with the frustration of this issue and I wouldn't want anyone to experience this. But at this point it's either buy back/lemon law or just ride it out until a solution is found. Which is hopefully sooner than later.

As far as my words towards your dealer, they may have been a bit harsh. But after working at the Hotline and talking to 30-40 dealers a day for years you have a tendency to notice that most dealers just don't know how to dealer.

So I feel as though you may not have mis-heard your adviser but I would be willing to bet that his version of this process is not quite right. You would be surprised (well maybe not) how many times dealers screw up behind the scenes.

I won't defend Ford to you guys anymore, this has gone on too long. But I will say that if engineering and diagnostics were that easy, we would all be doing it.

 

I commute approximately 150mi a day 4-5 days a week (2015 ST 37k bought new 6/5/15). Car still misfires and idle dips/hunts in traffic and coming to a stop. Almost stalled out quite a few times in heavy traffic. Tried new plugs, helped for a week.

Light hasn't come on in a while, but the car still runs like poop.


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If the Regional Customer Service Rep that you are referring to is from the CRC (customer relationship center), then you have to take what they say with a grain of salt. First reason is because they are not technical at all. But somehow you still find them giving diagnostics or telling a customer how a system works and they are wrong. They also can say things that imply that a repair is warrantable when it is not or that it is normal when it's not. Very frustrating to read, the hotline reviews all CRC comments as part of their job.

The other reason why they are frustrating is that they have a tendency to make their own decisions without informing anyone else. I have seen them schedule appointments without contacting the dealer. And vice verse, setting up times with the dealer and not contacting the customer. They also have the worse grammar and punctuation I have ever seen, mind you what they document can be used in court.

Don't get my wrong, the CRC can be useful during certain instances like needing a rental, needing help finding a dealer in the area, dispatching a towing company, documenting positive and negative dealer feedback, etc. Sometimes there is information in CRC comments from the customer that were not given to the dealer which can help the hotline diagnose the vehicle. They have their place for sure but a lot of the time they leave me scratching my head.

But yeah, this is weird. I still don't think it's mechanical, but maybe there is someone that knows more than I do. Hopefully they can figure it out.

And as far as the process, they me know if you have anymore questions. I can explain the entire process from beginning to end, well on how the process is supposed to work any how. Looks like this situation fell through the cracks.

 

2016, purchased end of March. I have 21k in 5 months, no misfire issues, and I have broken traction less than a dozen times.

I do need to get the stumble when coming to a stop TSB done tho, that's getting really annoying.

I've read every page of this thread, I'm scared....

 

Called my dealer this past Thursday. My service writer had gone on vacation hence why he didn't call me to let me know the status of my car.

Turns out they're not doing a block replacement. Thank god. The cylinder head has been ordered (this guy I spoke to had no idea when it would be in) and it's going on the car. That's it for now.

The better news is that I may finally be putting an end to this whole ordeal soon.







21k is pretty solid. If you haven't had issues yet, I'd venture to say you may be in the clear. The problem seems to hit cars before 10k on the odometer.

 

Me too, but I bought one anyway!! :shocked:

 

To bad my dealer is basically telling me to **** off till they have "fixed" the problem


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Trust me, you're better off than I am. At least you're driving your car. Enjoy that.

Mine's been at the dealer for 2 weeks now (for this current visit). I just went in person today to find out where this new cylinder head was. They have no clue. We spoke to the parts department and he confirmed it was ordered but he also had no clue when it would arrive. Good stuff. I ordered some batteries on Amazon this morning and I know exactly when they're going to arrive at my house but Ford has no clue when a $350 cylinder head will get delivered. Right.

I just want to drive the ****ing thing.

 

Hey again! CEL came back on last Saturday morning. Only thing different that I noticed is I let it run for close to 10 minutes before I got going. Usually I'm sitting in the car and just let the engine idle (which usually takes a minute or so). Brought it to the dealer today since I just got back from vacation, so I'll let you all know what they come back with. I think at this point though, from the dealership's perspective and the tech. I've been working with - he's not just going to throw parts at it since that's been done before. I also called Ford to make them aware and opened up my third case with them. I'm assuming the tech. and Ford will work together again. Not sure when I'll get my car back, but at least I got a new F150 out of it.

FYI - last time they replaced my fuel pump and I didn't have issues for a little while (not sure when my last post was).

OP - you are a patient man...

 

OP - you are a patient man...

Without a doubt! Take the car back, drive the piss out of it and if the engine blows you have a history of Ford's inability to assist with a known issue. You'll get a new engine out of the deal

 

Hey all - adding another one to the list. CEL came on this past Friday and I had a friend scan the code over the weekend. Random and cylinder 3 misfire. My car is a '16 with ~3300 miles on it. Taking it in for service in two days, but not very hopeful after reading through all of this. Has anyone made any progress with this issue? Thanks all.

 

No real progress except that we know Ford is still scratching their heads. They are aware of the problem and allegedly working on a fix. It has been like a year though. They replaced all my fuel injectors and I have gone about 3500 miles without a CEL. I still don't believe it is "fixed" though.

 

Just getting mine back after work for a misfire but still has CEL on. Was told to go back after a week to check if there is a solution. unsure of code but will ask once i get to the stealership

 

Asking questions is the worst because they legitimately have no answers.

You ask "why are you replacing my cylinder head" and they say "ford says it fixed someone elses car so we have to try it". That's ridiculous.

It's been 412 days since I first had this problem and Ford still has no answer. They can't identify the cause of the cold start misfires and they can't point out anything that will prevent it from happening.

I'd still bet that this is an issue that could be resolved with a PCM update but there is no sign that Ford is going to provide that. If you think they give a **** about this issue with our cars, I can assure you- they do not.

 

Some cars are just possessed I think. Reminds me of a 528 (N20 4cyl turbo DI) we had in the shop when I worked at BMW. Multiple random misfires. Been in and out of the shop countless times. BMW NA was involved on the second visit. Car got ignition coils, injectors, programming, a DME (PCM), and I think something else. The worst was every time a repair was made we would drive it over 50 miles with no issues. Customer picks it up and within a few weeks to a month he would be back. BMW trade assisted him out of the car. Worst part is BMW didn't take the car, it was wholesaled...so someone got that car somewhere...

 

What's up guys. New to the forums but been trying to catch up on this thread. My St got first CEL at 9916. Code p0303/0316. First time car was in the shop for about a month. They replaced short block and long block along with a bunch of other stuff. Just got the code again at 12710 and this time around they just cleared codes and said codes "shouldn't come back". Seems like they really don't know what's going on since after reading some of this thread, everyone is getting the runaround. They said engineering is currently investigating. Same thing they told me last time . Seems like everything I read says I'm SOL.

 

Pretty much. I believe it is still unconfirmed whether or not this is actually doing damage or its just an annoyance.

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Has anyone checked their MAF sensor? On my access port it shows a steady reading but if you unplug it while the car is idling the car doesn't change a single bit. Plug it back it still nothing. Possibility that all this is caused by that?


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The one by the air box? If so that is the air intake temperature sensor. It also serves another pupose that I don't recall. It's not your typical MAF sensor you might be familiar with. Lots of people get confused because the tube says MAF.

 

That would make sense why I didn't see an idle drop. Ik theirs the one by the air box, one on the intercooler, and one under the manifold


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I think the actual MAF is on one of the charge pipes.

 

Hello everyone,

I chimed in on this thread early on and just kind of took a back seat to see where it went. Can't believe all the disappointment and ongoing issues with the CEL misfire codes. My 2015 ST threw another misfire P0316 code just a few days ago so I took it in for service at my usual stellar dealership today. I figured I would let everyone know the results even though it basically just confirms what everyone else is hearing, "Engineering is working on it".

First a small summary of my misfire CEL occurrences. The first few around 4K-6K miles and the dealership did full diagnostics and cleared the codes along with reprogramming the Misfire Profile and KAM clear procedure (took over an hour) that seemed to help for a little while. Sure enough a few thousand miles later another code. This time I just ran it for a few days and even hit full boost just to see if anything would break lol .. nothing did but it cleared the code and CEL light went off by itself. I believe this happened 2 or 3 times so that's a total of 5 codes in the first 15k miles. Then around 20K miles another CEL so I planned to take it in again just to get it documented and see if they had any fixes, especially after reading here about all the ongoing concerns. So the next day when I took it into the dealer to look at the CEL and do the oil change the CEL disappeared on the way there. I reported it to them and as a courtesy they went ahead and hooked it up to the computer to look for any error codes. The technician came back puzzled and said nothing was stored and no evidence a CEL code was ever there. I was like oh well I'll bring it in next time when it comes on, since I knew it would sooner or later. I guess it's good news that the CEL and code goes away after a few days. I would rather have a fix though.

So today when I brought it in the CEL was still on and the service advisor was very familiar with the issue on Focus ST's. BTW I'm currently just about 24K miles. He also mentioned it affects some Mustangs too. He looked it up on OASIS and found no updates on the issue. He was cool enough to let me read the OASIS report and even gave me print out. I'll type out word for word what the OASIS report said here:

45788 Some Vehicles Could Exhibit Misfire Codes After Certain Repairs - Multiple Vehicle Lines
Some vehicles equipped with On Board Diagnostics (OBD) misfire monitor neutral profile learning capabilities may experience the MIL illuminating or flashing, accompanied by one or more engine misfire related codes(PO30x). These faults can be a result of the crankshaft position sensor profile (MR_LRN) not being relearned after engine transmission repairs. The MP_LRN data is no longer cleared with a battery disconnect. In order to properly reset the Misfire Profile, a KAM clear must be performed. Repairs that can require relearning the MP_LRN data with IDS include: crank sensor, trigger wheel, engine timing, and any time the engine or transmission (including DPS6) is removed. From the IDS toolbox select "Powertrain", "Service Functions", then "Misfire Monitor Neutral Profile Correction" and follow the on screen prompts.
EFFECTIVE DATE: 29-APRIL-2016

So this was the latest OASIS info and obviously does not explain why SO MANY vehicles have had this trouble without any of the named repairs. Especially the ones that constantly fail or fail very frequently. I feel lucky mine is only every few thousand miles and the CEL and code clears itself after a few days. The most recent code happened at start up when I noticed some abnormal shaking from the engine right after I hit the start button. I didn't notice the CEl appear until the next time I started the engine. Other times they occurred at low rpm's in in first or second gear, and all of them occurred when engine was cold.

The previous OASIS was not very helpful or encouraging but the advisor assured my Ford engineering is working on a fix. I asked him to have the tech's take a look at it after my oil change and just clear the code. Mostly I wanted to document the CEL so "just in case" I have record of it. He came back after some time and asked if I thought the CEL resulted in any drivability concerns. I told him "No" but it is annoying. He agreed and said the tech would just clear the code so I could get on my way without any delay. Sure they could of reprogrammed the Misfire Profile again but that didn't fix it last time so I guess it's best not to waste any more time with that procedure. I was just happy to back into my car and get on with my day lol.

Here is where I have some further news. The technician that cleared the code, and who is a friend of mine, approached me with some further information. He also assured me that Ford engineering is working on a solution and to be patient and one will hopefully come. When it does I'm sure there will be a long line of repairs and I'll be in that line lol .. anyway here is a word for word copy of what the tech gave me:

45856 2015-2016 Focus ST May illuminate the Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) With Misfire Codes
Some 2015-2016 Focus ST vehicles may exhibit MIL On with a perceived misfire after cold start. Diagnostic Trouble codes may include P0300, P0301, P0302, P0303, P0304, and P03016. Engineering is currently investigating this concern. Refer to Workshop Manual (WSM) Section, 303-01 for normal diagnostics. For drivability concerns Refer to Powertrain Control/Emissions Diagnostics (PC/ED) manual. To assist with the investigation use the Report A Vehicle Concern link at the bottom of the OASIS report and submit a Global Concern Report (GCR). Continue to monitor OASIS for updates.

So that's my update for the topic. It's sad such a great car can have these issues on a widespread basis but at least since it has been such an issue there is hope that Ford engineers will find a solution. C'mon Ford get it done please. I love my ST and looking forward to getting some good years and another 100K miles before I trade up to the RS!

:focus-st-smilie::RockOn::wink:

 

I just skimmed through most of this thread, slightly concerned as well. My 2015 ST threw a misfire code at 3600 miles during a cold startup, seemed to drive normally. I drove it straight to the dealer, ended up diagnosing it as bad #2 coil. They replaced the coil and I haven't had any issues up until recently. Earlier this week, I started the ST up to leave work and it immediately threw a CEL. Started to drive home and it was obvious a misfire condition. Rough idle, almost died twice while idling at a stop light. Vibration at 1500 rpm and could tell there was some loss of power while driving on the freeway. It has been at the dealer for three days with no update. The vehicle is bone stock with only 11,000 miles.

 

Noah, thanks for the update on your car.

Back on May 27th, Slow95Cobra posted a photo of that exact "engineering is working on it" update in Ford's system. It's the first post on page 43 of this thread:

http://www.focusst.org/forum/focus-...1024-check-engine-light-code-says-misfire-can-t-get-service-43.html#post1080027

So it's been almost 4 months since they officially recognized this issue as being at least somewhat wide spread. I'm taking my car in tomorrow to have the cylinder head replaced even though everyone in this thread knows that a cylinder head replacement will not solve this issue.

Either Ford still doesn't know the real root cause of this misfire issue (doubtful) or they do know the root cause but there's something about it that is keeping them from actually fixing our cars.

- Ford has many cases of this problem being reported to them
- Ford has extensive data mined from my car which captured this problem happening repeatedly
- According to people I've talked to, Ford possesses an affected car that is being / has been examined

If anyone with a pulse is actually working on this issue, they must know the cause by now.

 

Hello AK2112,

Got it, yes I figured this was not any new news. My fault for not reading through the entire thread as it has grown so large. Thanks for the reply and further details on the investigation. Man you would think something would of been released by now. Hopefully something comes soon. Ridiculous this issue does not have a solution yet. Surely Ford knows something by now as you mentioned. Good luck with yours and everyone else trying to resolve this.

 

An update on my car, I completed a lemon buy back in July after visiting service a total of 7 times in less than 1 year/15k miles. Symptoms were getting worse and continued after a head replacement.