The ST is fun stock.... It not super fast but it's fun. I always wonder what's really behind the desire to increase the power by 100 hp. I mean these are the same people that can't get the car to hook up if their lives dependant on it and want to buy all sort of devices and bars to help with traction when it hasn't proven to do so.

Do the math, I believe Stratified's 2 injector setup is 1000cc total. The stock fuel system record for the ST is 466 hp. That car used a GTX2971 turbo from ATP (.86 A/R) on Sunoco 110 octane low lead fuel.

What does that mean? It means if you aren't after big power then the stock fuel system is fine. If you want to avoid the cost of racing fuel, get a water-methanol system. Don't tell me you want to run E40/E50 with a port injection setup when it might make 10-12 hp more than the same car with the same turbo but 50/50 water methanol flowing enough to support the power level you want.

The ST community really needs to get a grip on reality. If you want to run E85 then run it, don't cut/mix it with pump gas, that is pointless you take an economy hit above E20 anyway (per SAE testing) so going up to E50 makes no difference really. You already got max oxygen benefit which is where your bump in horsepower comes from and it's lower energy content has less impact at E20 than at E50, IE you would get better fuel economy.

Water-methanol will make the same power, maybe more and be less of a hassle overall. No fuel economy hit because at low boost you would be burning the pump fuel. Safety is overrated, make sure your methanol tank is full all the time if you drive aggressively. With 1 gallon tank and you can plumb in the stock washer tank for more capacity as well should last you a month if not longer.

E85 pump fuel which is inferior to Ignite 98 or VP C85 should really left for those who want big power = 600+

500+ hp has already been done on this platform which just water injection.

 

Being a guy who has used pump, meth, and e85 in various platforms at quite a few power levels I want to add to what you're saying here.

The ST is fun stock.... It not super fast but it's fun. I always wonder what's really behind the desire to increase the power by 100 hp. I mean these are the same people that can't get the car to hook up if their lives dependant on it and want to buy all sort of devices and bars to help with traction when it hasn't proven to do so.

Do the math, I believe Stratified's 2 injector setup is 1000cc total. The stock fuel system record for the ST is 466 hp. That car used a GTX2971 turbo from ATP (.86 A/R) on Sunoco 110 octane low lead fuel.

What does that mean? It means if you aren't after big power then the stock fuel system is fine. If you want to avoid the cost of racing fuel, get a water-methanol system. Don't tell me you want to run E40/E50 with a port injection setup when it might make 10-12 hp more than the same car with the same turbo but 50/50 water methanol flowing enough to support the power level you want.

The ST community really needs to get a grip on reality. If you want to run E85 then run it, don't cut/mix it with pump gas, that is pointless you take an economy hit above E20 anyway (per SAE testing) so going up to E50 makes no difference really. You already got max oxygen benefit which is where your bump in horsepower comes from and it's lower energy content has less impact at E20 than at E50, IE you would get better fuel economy. This statement has quite a bit wrong with it. There is absolutely a point to run e85 mixed with pump gas, and NO it does not just come from the added oxygen NOR do you get the maximum benefit with E20. Ethanol adds quite a bit in the way of both oxygen AND(this is the important one) octane. Typically the gains continue up to E50 and level off a bit after that, unless the car has absolutely extreme octane demands(I would argue that with the cylinder pressures seen with a small turbo and low RPM you will likely benefit from higher than 50%.)

Water-methanol will make the same power, maybe more and be less of a hassle overall. No fuel economy hit because at low boost you would be burning the pump fuel. Safety is overrated, make sure your methanol tank is full all the time if you drive aggressively. With 1 gallon tank and you can plumb in the stock washer tank for more capacity as well should last you a month if not longer.

E85 pump fuel which is inferior to Ignite 98 or VP C85 should really left for those who want big power = 600+

500+ hp has already been done on this platform which just water injection.

Now to answer OPS question. If you're going to run ANY additional fueling direct port is the way to go(meth, ethanol, race fuel, whatever.) You are correct in that the fueling is very unequal when you start flowing wet through a manifold that was designed as dry. I also would agree with your thoughts about safety from ethanol. That being said, you may not need an aux fueling setup with the stock turbo. Plenty of guys running e30 on the factory fuel system with the stock turbo making everything the baby turbo can make.

 

I'm going BT still not sure size yet . Think I'll go with 4 port just because i dont want to say I wish I did after .

 

WRONG - http://www.speedperf6rmanc3.com/content/DI E85 SAE Article.pdf

As PER SAE in DI cars (GM product doesn't matter however) -

Intermediate blends near E20 can provide the majority of the
performance benefit of E85 and enable strategies that offset
their lower energy penalty.

According to VP Chemist, the oxygen content is higher in one gallon of E85 than in VP M1.

That said, yes you DO derive the benefit of oxygen from partial mixing is with pump gas which is oxygenated since it is blended with ethanol to create E10 (91) or E15 (93).

Top Tier gas does not have enough ethanol to see the oxygen benefit. You need a concentration higher than 15% by weight. Which is why @E20 you see a bump in power without adding much timing and a little more power by adding mor advance.

The Tuning School made the most power out of all the racing fuels and barely beat 50/50 water methanol with 40% pump mixed with 93 and 40% VP C85 mixed with 93 which produced it's extra output at high rpm.

The oxygen bump provides the BULK of the increase in power, not additional ignition timing. Mixing with the stock turbo is fine and acceptable, I did it. It's also decent in a pinch when you don't have race gas as E30 is very close to 100 octane unleaded in performance. I ran VP 101 and E30 in my car and the logs are nearly identical.

100% E85 provides additional cooling because like anything else the weak link in E85 is the 15% 87 octane pump gas it's mixed with. That is why Ignite 98 and VP C-85 make as much as 50+ hp more than the best pump E85 you can find with no changes to boost levels or timing.

I asked, I didn't assume just because I used X, Y and Z and assume to know all the answers.

Stock Block record was done on 50/50 water methanol (527 hp). Go ahead and spend the extra coin on port injection. For that price I bought water methanol, extra nozzle, nitrous oxide and progressive control for it.

Turbos love ethanol, they like nitrous even better...

 

WRONG - http://www.speedperf6rmanc3.com/content/DI E85 SAE Article.pdf

As PER SAE in DI cars (GM product doesn't matter however) -

Intermediate blends near E20 can provide the majority of the
performance benefit of E85 and enable strategies that offset
their lower energy penalty.

Here's a quote for you directly from your article: "This application did not require exclusive E85 operation since peak cylinder pressures limits required spark retard which reduced the octane requirement.They concluded the development of engines permitting increased peak cylinder temperatures would enable increased power densities with E85 without the need for spark retard or PE." Which means that they keep the engine below the limit required for e85. Very simply, e85 allows more performance exactly like I said. I would also argue that e85 is injected via port injectors on our application once over a very low power level so this doesn't even apply. It's well known(not gonna link articles because I shouldn't need to) that e85 generally makes good power up to E50 then tapers off unless the octane requirement is intense.

According to VP Chemist, the oxygen content is higher in one gallon of E85 than in VP M1.
Which again isn't where the power comes from. It comes from the effective octane, allowing higher cylinder pressures through boost/timing. Science will show you, by comparing the effective BTU's of each fuel that you cannot possibly make the type of gains which are seen on ethanol(switching from pump fuels, AGAIN limited octane) from just the increase in oxygen.

That said, yes you DO derive the benefit of oxygen from partial mixing is with pump gas which is oxygenated since it is blended with ethanol to create E10 (91) or E15 (93).

Top Tier gas does not have enough ethanol to see the oxygen benefit. You need a concentration higher than 15% by weight. Which is why @E20 you see a bump in power without adding much timing and a little more power by adding mor advance.
Yes, there is a bump in power from just the ethanol. As I said before the benefit comes from the octane. With it you're able to run more BOOST AND TIMING(if the setup is octane limited, which damn near every pump gas boosted setup is)

The Tuning School made the most power out of all the racing fuels and barely beat 50/50 water methanol with 40% pump mixed with 93 and 40% VP C85 mixed with 93 which produced it's extra output at high rpm.



The oxygen bump provides the BULK of the increase in power, not additional ignition timing. Mixing with the stock turbo is fine and acceptable, I did it. It's also decent in a pinch when you don't have race gas as E30 is very close to 100 octane unleaded in performance. I ran VP 101 and E30 in my car and the logs are nearly identical.
Octane octane octane....

100% E85 provides additional cooling because like anything else the weak link in E85 is the 15% 87 octane pump gas it's mixed with. That is why Ignite 98 and VP C-85 make as much as 50+ hp more than the best pump E85 you can find with no changes to boost levels or timing.
On a platform with 300whp you're not gaining 50 hp from switching from pump e to a racing e85 blend without increasing boost/timing. This statement is total bull**** in the context of focus ST. MAYBE just MAYBE if you have a very high power output engine you would see 50 hp. Otherwise thats a hell naw from me.

I asked, I didn't assume just because I used X, Y and Z and assume to know all the answers.

Stock Block record was done on 50/50 water methanol (527 hp). Go ahead and spend the extra coin on port injection. For that price I bought water methanol, extra nozzle, nitrous oxide and progressive control for it.
It's obviously preference, but I can guarantee you that the cylinder to cylinder AFR variation is much larger doing it this way. Which is a risk that's not worth the relatively small investment on any engine I care about.

Turbos love ethanol, they like nitrous even better...

I'll go ahead and add a term for anyone reading, it is MBT. Which is the whole point of switching fuels to begin with.