[SSgtjrobertson]

This interesting quick little read I happened across while conducting an experiment on increased fuel trims due to higher E content makes a few good points. If modifying our current commercially available fuels with higher ethanol content (over the advertised "up to 10%") reduced dangerous polluting chemicals, increased performance (efficiency) and helps to stretch a precious resource why the increased push to EV? We are struggling with our infrastructure as it is.

But we still have land for growing...

 

[SSgtjrobertson]

PDF version

 

[TurboGT]

I'm all for it. As long as they don't skimp out and mix Ethanol with an even inferior octane gasoline. At that point it does very little from a performance standpoint.

 

[mattdamon33]

I’ll take more ethanol any day turned or not, yes I understand it burns faster but
If it saves me a few cents I guess it’s fine

 

[junits15]

I’m a cynic

they’re going to mix with inferior gasoline to keep the prices lower at the refinery but charge exactly the same for the fuel

 

[rambleon84]

I’m a cynic

they’re going to mix with inferior gasoline to keep the prices lower at the refinery but charge exactly the same for the fuel

You are probably right, existing pumps that are premixed typically look something like this:

(Lol those prices are def very old)

So their e30 is 93 octane vs we mixing 93 octane gas with e10 with e85, I'm hoping for ~96 octane e30:

And me at e40, 97-98octane:

For those looking for a cost savings on 93 octane benefit, might be a good idea but for me tuning for the reliable HP, I'll happily still blend myself.

Playing with the calculator, looks like they would be blending with like an 89 octane fuel:

 

[MailmanMike]

I was running full E85 when the engine blew in January. I filled every two days and burned 10 gallons in those two days. I was saving $4-5 every fill up over E30(93 and E85) and 93 octane. That’s with the mileage drop from 28-29 to 24-25 mpg. E85 was $1 cheaper at the time than 93. All on a 450/450 tune running a G25-550 and 4 port auxiliary fuel.

 

[rambleon84]

I was running full E85 when the engine blew in January. I filled every two days and burned 10 gallons in those two days. I was saving $4-5 every fill up over E30(93 and E85) and 93 octane. That’s with the mileage drop from 28-29 to 24-25 mpg. E85 was $1 cheaper at the time than 93. All on a 450/450 tune running a G25-550 and 4 port auxiliary fuel.

Did you break it out by cost per mile at all? I'd be curious to see that. My fuely app has a guage you can add to track that over different time periods but it's just dividing cost by miles

 

[mininsx]

You can sure tell that article comes from a pro-ethanol point of view. There's a lot of misinformation in the article.

 

[SSgtjrobertson]

You can sure tell that article comes from a pro-ethanol point of view. There's a lot of misinformation in the article.

What would you claim is mis-information?

 

[MailmanMike]

Did you break it out by cost per mile at all? I'd be curious to see that. My fuely app has a guage you can add to track that over different time periods but it's just dividing cost by miles

Round trip two days was 240 miles exactly. I don’t remember what the price was just it was $1 different. I did the math back then.
So 10 gallons at say $2.= $20 for two days at 240 miles. [email protected] $3 X 8 gallons= $24 so that’s where I got my number.

 

[davesST]

While I like the fact that it might give you a bit more octane/oomph, and perhaps shaving a few cents off prices. Still, I don’t believe it’s wise to be burning up our food supply, especially now, given the fertilizer shortages. Food prices are going to suck this coming Autumn. Unless they’re going to be using corn that’s no fit for human or livestock consumption.

 

[ddfred]

While I like the fact that it might give you a bit more octane/oomph, and perhaps shaving a few cents off prices. Still, I don’t believe it’s wise to be burning up our food supply, especially now, given the fertilizer shortages. Food prices are going to suck this coming Autumn. Unless they’re going to be using corn that’s no fit for human or livestock consumption.

The corn they use is silage, which is barely fit for animal consumption and not fit for human consumption. You definitely would not want to eat it; it's pretty tough. They grind it up to use for feed. Only a very small percentage of the corn grown in this county is sweet corn for human consumption...like less than 5%.

 

[SSgtjrobertson]

While I like the fact that it might give you a bit more octane/oomph, and perhaps shaving a few cents off prices. Still, I don’t believe it’s wise to be burning up our food supply, especially now, given the fertilizer shortages. Food prices are going to suck this coming Autumn. Unless they’re going to be using corn that’s no fit for human or livestock consumption.

Unfortunately we import the bulk of everything now. Two of our largest sod farmers in the area now dedicated the bulk of their fields to growing soy beans that are subsidized federally.

We need to decided. Either we import everything or we begin to use our own resources to rebuild. Domestic oil, natural gas, low yield waste nuclear power all of it, Hemp! Any and all of it.

EV vehicles are absolutely a great idea, but batteries in their current form destroy the environment and tax an aging and strained electrical infrastructure. Solar is weak. Wind is unreliable, hydro electric is location limited.
Everything need to be openly explored and used to its fullest advantage. Other countries produce coal, ship that coal to China in fossil fuel burning ships, China burns that coal to produce the solar panels our country subsidizes and then ship it to us on more fossil fuel burning ship and aircraft. And we then create more government programs to give them away and pat ourselves on the back at the zero net emissions equipment we installed...

I remember sitting in line as a little kid in the gas lines of the 70's and I also know what's about to follow if we don't change direction and fast.

 

[xTheMan42]

While I like the fact that it might give you a bit more octane/oomph, and perhaps shaving a few cents off prices. Still, I don’t believe it’s wise to be burning up our food supply, especially now, given the fertilizer shortages. Food prices are going to suck this coming Autumn. Unless they’re going to be using corn that’s no fit for human or livestock consumption.

Don't buy into what the talking points pump out.

 

[davesST]

The corn they use is silage, which is barely fit for animal consumption and not fit for human consumption. You definitely would not want to eat it; it's pretty tough. They grind it up to use for feed. Only a very small percentage of the corn grown in this county is sweet corn for human consumption...like less than 5%.

I see. Wasn’t sure of what grade/type of corn they were using for ethanol.

 

[Duece McCracken]

I love me E85.

I'd rather pay more to keep the money in this country and try to rebuild industry here. Rather see us import less **** that we can make/grow here.

That's a whole rant though. I'm Union, try to buy Union made, and stimulate US based manufacturing/goods as much as I can.

So if the corns here, we make the E85, and I make 500whp with it right now, **** yes I want that industry to grow.

 

[TurboGT]

I agree. I'll spend more money to buy goods made here. With so much of the **** sent overseas we need to. "Global economy" they say. I like how were expected to help everyone else but who's going to help us when we drive our economy into the ****ter by not taking care of our own?


This is why I like weather tech so much. They have the same mindset and even purchase their shelving and forklifts from American companies. Granted, the racks might or might not be made from overseas steel, and the forklifts are probably made with at least a percentage of overseas parts (electronics). But that's nearly unavoidable at this stage in the game. If we're conscious about it maybe we can make ECMs and stuff here and can be totally self reliant

 

[SSgtjrobertson]

I agree. I'll spend more money to buy goods made here. With so much of the **** sent overseas we need to. "Global economy" they say. I like how were expected to help everyone else but who's going to help us when we drive our economy into the ****ter by not taking care of our own?


This is why I like weather tech so much. They have the same mindset and even purchase their shelving and forklifts from American companies. Granted, the racks might or might not be made from overseas steel, and the forklifts are probably made with at least a percentage of overseas parts (electronics). But that's nearly unavoidable at this stage in the game. If we're conscious about it maybe we can make ECMs and stuff here and can be totally self reliant

Also need to really begin to protect intellectual property as well. too much is contracted overseas for manufacturing only to be cloned and sold out from under us.

 

[kgh]

This interesting quick little read I happened across while conducting an experiment on increased fuel trims due to higher E content makes a few good points. If modifying our current commercially available fuels with higher ethanol content (over the advertised "up to 10%") reduced dangerous polluting chemicals, increased performance (efficiency) and helps to stretch a precious resource why the increased push to EV? We are struggling with our infrastructure as it is.

But we still have land for growing...

View attachment 405515

View attachment 405516

Ethanol blends have been a matter of scientific debate from way back, with the carbon footprint being one of the main bones of contention.

In 2006 a Berkeley team found that corn ethanol blends were better than gasoline, but not by much, comparing corn to cellulosic ethanol (produced from non-edible botanical biomass such as corn stalks, switchgrass, wood, and so on), where cellulosic ethanol has a lower impact. They encouraged technological development in the latter area, where enzymes are necessary to break down the plant fibers: cellulose, hemicellulose, lignins, and so on, into fermentable sugars. Engineered fungi have been used to produce cellulase enzymes capable of hydrolyzing these plant polymers and structural components rapidly enough to make this method practical. Another method is acid hydrolysis. Specially engineered yeast have also been developed that secrete the enzymes to break down the fibers and then ferment the resulting sugars. Bacteria have also been used.

Ethanol from corn is still the most widely produced.

Since the Berkeley study, there have been many more that either support corn ethanol blends or condemn them:

Corn ethanol reduces carbon footprint, greenhouse gases | Argonne National Laboratory

www.anl.gov

Building the Evidence on Corn Ethanol’s Greenhouse Gas Profile

Over the past two decades, the demand for renewable fuels — including corn-based ethanol — has helped drive a strong domestic market for corn, and supported rural America by generating jobs (PDF, 1.5 MB). New research is confirming that corn ethanol also has more greenhouse gas benefits than...

www.usda.gov

https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2101084119

I'm sure the final word has yet to be written...