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2013 ST2, AGP BWS turbo, long block
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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
If you were big turbo, you'd still need a better fuel solution eventually.

This mod would buy you some more Hp before you ran into that point, but RS's still run out of fuel like an ST.. Just a few ponies later in the quest for power.
 

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2013 ST2, AGP BWS turbo, long block
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Discussion Starter · #22 · (Edited)
The guys over on the RS forum have had it out about how much the stock RS pump can flow.

After skimming this thread it seems that about 425-450 is the limit. Someone claims 425whp on E30.

@Bugasu did a nice breakdown on theoretical limits..

HPFP comparison:
2.0L EB stock: 0.90 cc/cam rev, 2200psi
2.3L EB stock: 1.12 cc/cam rev, 2900 psi
2.0L EB Xtreme DI: 1.22 cc/cam rev, 2900 psi (discontinued?)
2.3L EB Xtreme DI-35: 1.52cc/cam rev, 2900 psi
2.3L EB Xtreme DI-60: 1.83cc/cam rev, 3625 psi

So it makes sense that the RS fuel system limit is at around 425 whp while the ST鈥檚 is something like 370. Definitely a considerable improvement.. more than I was thinking honestly. I would like to snag a BNR 3071 sometime in the near future. Of course would post results.
 

Premium Member
2013 ST2, AGP BWS turbo, long block
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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Also,
Ive been thinking about ways to make this more accessible than welding.
Ive got a loose idea for how a tapped bolt on adapter solution could be made.

I鈥檒l need to buy another RS fuel lobe cover and spend some time drafting something that I could make

If its successful and there is interest, I鈥檇 make a small batch of them and throw them on here for sale. Anyone want to see this happen?
1 like = you鈥檇 swap your cams for 4 lobe if this was available.
 

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...If its successful and there is interest, I鈥檇 make a small batch of them and throw them on here for sale. Anyone want to see this happen?...
I鈥檓 interested but not yet committed.

You鈥檙e doing some awesome stuff man!! Thanks for sharing your research! 馃憤
 

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Also,
Ive been thinking about ways to make this more accessible than welding.
Ive got a loose idea for how a tapped bolt on adapter solution could be made.

I鈥檒l need to buy another RS fuel lobe cover and spend some time drafting something that I could make

If its successful and there is interest, I鈥檇 make a small batch of them and throw them on here for sale. Anyone want to see this happen?
1 like = you鈥檇 swap your cams for 4 lobe if this was available.
I would buy one just to have it on hand for the future.
 

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You'd never install it, though.

馃槝
lmao, things are in process. It wont be much longer now.

I'm not gonna attempt to do cams right now, but life has taught me that if there is a custom one off part available that would make your life easier, it's smart to grab it before they disappear forever.
 

Premium Member
2013 ST2, AGP BWS turbo, long block
Joined
970 Posts
Discussion Starter · #28 · (Edited)
I skipped E50 and put some straight E85 in last night. Tuned for it, which basically just involves changing the desired lamba during WOT, Desired Stoich, and cutting boost down in the fuel starve range.. with a maximum of 21 psi, it runs fantastic. No knock, The fuel comes down to about 700 psi during starve range. I run about 19 psi up top anyways with this hybrid. Definitely some performance lost in the low rpm due to fuel constraints, but the top rpm range flies.

Honestly not a performance gain. So far, it doesn't seem like I can run any more timing than the E40 +WMI, making that blend the ideal performance blend for my setup.
But it is unbelievably cheap at the pump!
 

Premium Member
2013 ST2, AGP BWS turbo, long block
Joined
970 Posts
Discussion Starter · #30 · (Edited)
No.
Unfortunately I'm having unrelated issues with my fuel system. Pump is healthy and the TIG welding that I did is holding up beautifully with no visible signs of crack formation.

Something is going on with my fuel rail / injectors
 

Premium Member
2013 ST2, AGP BWS turbo, long block
Joined
970 Posts
Discussion Starter · #31 ·
No knock, The fuel comes down to about 700 psi during starve range. I run about 19 psi up top anyways with this hybrid.
You should never see 700 psi. thats way too low by the way.
 

Premium Member
2013 ST2, AGP BWS turbo, long block
Joined
970 Posts
Discussion Starter · #38 · (Edited)
When you swapped to the RS cam cap, I was curious if you had to get the head line bored so that the new cap lines up right

Or if it worked without touching it, or if you haven鈥檛 found out yet lol
The line bore concern was a contribution from a machinist.
I personally wanted to do @Moment 's method of pulling an RS cam cap.
The reason they don't sell the cam caps individually (from dealer, part store, or Ebay) is because they are line bored to the engine.
For this reason, combined with the machinist's concern of dislocating the cam bore, I welded mine.

The cap bolt hole location on @Moment 's build may now be slightly dislocated for the Camshaft Bore.... It might be dead on. who knows. This is why Ford line bores it to remove all doubt.

The cam bore is a very tightly tolerance surface, Likely toleranced to 1/10th of a thou (no citation here lol). Oil pressure in the journal is very specific to this tolerance.
If its off center it could lead to premature wear and incorrect oil distribution in the journal.
But then again, most Hondas don't even need piston rings to run so who cares?

The part definitely expands and contracts during welding. From what I could measure it contracted back to its correct shape due to even and rapid aluminum heat conduction. measurement devices I have don't go below 0.001".
I think we have a lesser of two evils situation here.
View attachment 400234


I don't know what the hole marked in blue is for? When applying a pump with 2.3 ecoboost, it has no use because it enters the hole in the pump housing with 2.3 eb.
The hole in blue is marked to show that Ford anticipated the 2.3L motor. The blue hole has no use in the 2013 2.0L engine, but they planned for the 2016 2.3L
We are saying the same thing :)

@Moment
Thank you so much for the pictures and doing this pull! excellent material for anyone else going down this path. I will put a link to your screenshot thread in the title post.
 

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hey see my previous comparison explained a lot.
So I decided to make another comparison.

Land vehicle Tire Vehicle Wheel Car

2.0 ecoboost


Tire Wheel Automotive tire Vehicle Motor vehicle

2.3 ecoboost.

As you can see in the photos, the dimensions are the same. The bushings were tightened with the same torque.
Automotive tire Motor vehicle Bumper Automotive exterior Rim



I also dimensioned the holes for the mounting screws.
Automotive tire Bumper Motor vehicle Bicycle part Gas

2.0 ecoboost

Automotive tire Bumper Automotive exterior Rim Gas

2.3 ecoboost

Here are a few more photos comparing the two cups.
Bicycle part Rim Engineering Machine tool Automotive design

Motor vehicle Gas Automotive exterior Machine tool Machine



Everything fits together perfectly. You don't need to weld anything or make any other modifications.
 
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