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Thread: Second Battery for Amplifiers

  1. #141
    FST Senior Member boostinburgh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by G heinrich View Post
    I've also wondered since the output of our alternators are you controlled by the PCM. Does it see the load from our amplifiers if you are connected directly to the battery increase the output of the alternator. Also I believe it see the load through the ground side. But I'm not sure I believe that's how it was on my 09 SE.
    Maybe the focus can’t handle it...

    Can a tuner change the output functions of the alternator? Haha

  2. #142
    I spend too much of my life on FST! G heinrich's Avatar
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    The alternator is grounded to the engine through all of its mounting points. Therefore you want to add is 0 gauge chassis ground to battery. engine ground to chassis. They can both be connected to the chassis at the same point. The hot side of alternator to battery. That is the big three.

  3. #143
    FST Senior Member boostinburgh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by G heinrich View Post
    The alternator is grounded to the engine through all of its mounting points. Therefore you want to add is 0 gauge chassis ground to battery. engine ground to chassis. They can both be connected to the chassis at the same point. The hot side of alternator to battery. That is the big three.
    Would you fuse the alternator positive ? If so, where would you mount the fuse?

  4. #144
    FST Senior Member boostinburgh's Avatar
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    I already did the battery to chassis ground with 1/0 OFC. I hear there is an engine ground towards passenger rear of motor I can tap into for that. Then I have to locate the positive terminal on alternator. Someone said it should be red? I see a black cap with a nut and wire looking like it’s going towards battery. I think that’s the positive ?

  5. #145
    I spend too much of my life on FST! G heinrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boostinburgh View Post
    I already did the battery to chassis ground with 1/0 OFC. I hear there is an engine ground towards passenger rear of motor I can tap into for that. Then I have to locate the positive terminal on alternator. Someone said it should be red? I see a black cap with a nut and wire looking like it’s going towards battery. I think that’s the positive ?


    I haven't looked at my alternator but that's probably the positive with the black cap.usually if you pop the cap off there's red plastic around the stud isolating it from the alternator housing. Yes I would fuse the alternator wire it's close to the alternator I would think as you can get it. As far as mounting it I have no idea.its another pretty big fuse. I believe the alternator puts out 150 amps. You shouldn't need to go to the back of the motor. You should be able to hook your engine ground anywhere there's a bolt on the engine.
    Last edited by G heinrich; 05-13-2019 at 04:41 PM.

  6. #146
    FST Junkie! 1LoudST's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boostinburgh View Post
    I read this article from JL Audio stating I will never get my car to put out enough power.

    https://jlaudio.zendesk.com/hc/en-us...bile_site=true
    there is one huge hole with this guys logic(most of it is right, but some is not 100% true).

    OK what this guys seems to be forgetting when he says that a 2000w amp will never pull 2000w because of the voltage and amperage from the alternator and Ohms law is the fact that the battery is a HUGE power storage unit and it can dump HUGE amounts of power. normally the battery is just for starting the car and then the car runs off of the alternator while the engine is running and the altys surplus power can be used to charge that amp right back up. but most batteries can dump 500-750 amps of current for a short amount of time, so as long as the power wire is thick enough, you can hit 2000w all day long (let us not forget that music is not constant and fluctuates all the time)

    Quote Originally Posted by boostinburgh View Post
    Should I try another battery in hatch? Without upgrading the alt or doing the rest of the big three, could the extra battery even help me?

    I can add the extra battery, since I already ran the 1/0 back there, but I don’t feel comfortable doing the rest of the big three or replacing alternator.
    Heres the rub, adding another battery can give you more current for longer(more reserve power), BUT in the end, if you are on average drawing more power than what the alt can put out, even the second battery is going to get so low that you will run out of stored power too, it will just take longer to get there.


    Quote Originally Posted by boostinburgh View Post
    How hard is it to get to the negative post of the alt? What safety precautions are needed messing with the alternator?
    Technically, there is no such thing as a negative post of the alternator, the car/engine/alternator is a negative ground system, therefore the ground is the negative terminal. long story short, any bolt touching metal going into the alternator or the engine is a negative terminal.

    Quote Originally Posted by boostinburgh View Post
    I keep seeing contradicting info on the big three. Exo on YouTube runs a ground from alt negative to battery negative. Sonic electronic just upgrades the engine ground to chassis and does not touch the alternator ground. Exo doesn’t touch the engine ground though! Other people commenting saying to upgrade engine to chassis ground AS WELL as adding engine to battery negative ground...
    Most of these are actually the exact same thing... Again, the car is a negative ground based system. alternators do not have their own factory ground to the body or the battery of the car, instead since they are bolted directed to the engine block, they ground THROUGH the engine, and then the engine will ground to the body of the car with the engine ground.

    When doing the big three (battery ground, engine ground, alt to battery), it doesn't make any difference if you run a ground wire from the body to the engine block or if you run a ground wire from the actual body of the alternator to the body of the car it is doing the exact same thing.



    Quote Originally Posted by boostinburgh View Post
    Would you fuse the alternator positive ? If so, where would you mount the fuse?
    now this is the part almost everybody fukcs up. when doing the big three (or also when adding a second battery) you need to add two fuses, one right at the battery (always put the fuse as close as possible to the source of power) to protect the battery side of the wire and you also need to put a fuse right at the alternator to protect that side of the wire. most people don't think of the alternator side of the wire and what a lot of people don't realize is that a lot of cars has a fused alternator wire. some had an actual fuse that you can see, but most will have a hidden fuseable link in the wire (when the "fuse" blows, you have to replace the whole wire).

    Think of it this way, if somebody did a sh!tty job running their power wire and it got pinched while the engine was running, the fuse at the battery will blow and this will keep the battery from continuing to short out which can cause the battery or even the wire itself to catch fire, BUT if there is no fuse at the alternator, then the alternator will continue to short out which will usually destroy the alternator but it can also cause the wire to get hot and start a fire.



    IF you do decide to add a second battery, please for the love of god do not make some of the dangerous mistakes I usually see on the internet... First, batterys vent when somthing goes wrong. so you either need to get a vented battery and run a vent tube outside of the car, or get a legit battery box (for in cabin installation) and vent it so you can use a normal non vented battery. also a battery is a huge chuck of mass, please make sure that it is securley mounted down so in case you ever get into an accident, it stays put and doesn't hurt anyone. lastly, make sure you add another fuse holder at the rear battery for safety.





    also to help trouble shoot the problem, a cheap and easy tool to get would be a power port volt meter. even sometime as simple as this

    https://www.amazon.com/LIHAN-Charger...ateway&sr=8-28

    would work, sure its not going to be as accurate as a DDM, but it will read voltage and you can just leave it plugged in the whole time your driving around. when the music starts cutting off, you can just take a quick look at it to see whats going on instead of playing the music real loud in your driveway and pissing off your neighbors.

    there are a couple of other things to consider, first while normally not a problem to overdrive it, your amp is more powerful than the sub can handle (by about 1/3). L7s usually dont have any problems taking more power than they are rated for but especially being in a ported box and not being the most SQ oriented subwoofer it can be hard to tell if the sub is clipping/bottoming out (which is a little different from normal amp clipping) and that could cause the amp to go into protect mode.

    also just for sh!ts and giggles, I know that dual amp is not very efficient. what I would try to do is unplug the rear RCAs so that the amp is not outputting anything to the rear, then turn the gain down to about half what you have it at now and go and drive around for a while (yes, at this point it wont sound good and the bass will be too heavy but we are just testing here) and see if it still cuts out on the same songs. you do say it tends to happen the most when the music has a lot of mids and highs, while yes, that kicker amp does draw a lot of power, it is still pretty damn efficient and doesn't waste a lot of power. I'm wondering if your Dual amp is just soaking up more power than it needs to and contributing to the kicker going into protect mode.

  7. #147
    FST Senior Member boostinburgh's Avatar
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    Thank you so much! So even if using an xs xp battery I would still need to seal a box around and vent outside of vehicle?

  8. #148
    FST Senior Member boostinburgh's Avatar
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    Dude is that cigarette lighter voltage meter not the coolest thing ever!!!??? Ordering right now haha

  9. #149
    I spend too much of my life on FST! G heinrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boostinburgh View Post
    Dude is that cigarette lighter voltage meter not the coolest thing ever!!!??? Ordering right now haha

    I'd prefer something like this. Throw in an auxiliary battery with an isolator relay. You can monitor the voltage of both batteries independently. Then you know if the battery in the back is getting low and you need to start the car to charge it up if you happen to be parked.


    MICTUNING LED Digital Double Voltmeter, Round Panel Voltage Monitor Blue for Car Pickup RV Truck Dual Battery Pack https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0721PQCKD..._xs02Cb9YNFP3P

  10. #150
    FST Senior Member boostinburgh's Avatar
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    So the entire stereo shuts off when slamming on brakes. I checked battery terminals and it’s ground and it’s all snug. I think maybe even the dash screen went out too. The car doesn’t stall. Worried something dangerous is occurring...

 

 
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